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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@virgola

AmigaForever, Lenovo T520 with Intel i7 2670QM 2,2Ghz.

4:30

MorhpOS 3.17, Lame 3.99.5 for MorphOS, Mac Mini 1,5Ghz G4

0:12


Edited by benny on 2023/5/1 14:05:59
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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Hans

just replied our survey.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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00:04 on my X1000 ;)

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@white
@Maijestro

Thank you for all your discussion and insights into this topic.

I welcome polite discussion about emulation, OS4, MorphOS, AROS and hardware.

Since I already own an OS4 system, it never occurred to me to attempt to emulate OS4 on other hardware.

But this has been an interesting discussion and you guys have put in alot of effort.

Thanks so much,
redfox

P.S. I have done more traditional emulation.
In my case, OS3 running on E-UAE running on OS4.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@virgola

0:08 on my X5000 with Lame 3.100

The high performance core in your I7-1265u itself is about 10x faster than the e5500 core. The memory performance is even better (compared to the poor P5020 single core DDR memory performance). Yet the result is 8 times slower under winuae and almost 10 times for QEMU. This means an emulation efficiency of 1-1.25%. I would expect an emulation efficiency of about 10% so something is definitly wrong here. Maybe no JIT like Hans is suggesting?


Edited by geennaam on 2023/5/1 21:20:48
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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@geennaam

QEMU does have JIT, but I remember it being rather slow. IIRC, their JIT compiler uses techniques that make it very portable, but obviously doesn't generate the most efficient code. I vaguely remember reading about some technique that uses the C compiler to generate the assembly stubs for individual instructions. If that's what they (still) do, then it's not surprising that it would be slower then a well-crafted JIT whose code contains assembly written specifically for the host CPU.

Hans

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Hans
QEMU do have KVM : same naming as KVM switches, but different meaning : KVM in QEMU allowing you to run emulation running on the same as emulated CPU platform through real CPU without emulating it: so, theoretically, you should be able someday to run QEMU on PPC Macs with the “same” speed.

But again, emulation issues/bugs and no 3d, still will be there. And PPC Macs is also today not of big interest. But if theoretically somewhere will be PPC on 4GHZ single core, then running QEMU-KVM on such a beast will be cool.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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Deleted, sorry.

--
AmigaONE X1000 and Radeon RX 560
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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@kas1e
Quote:
QEMU do have KVM : same naming as KVM switches, but different meaning : KVM in QEMU allowing you to run emulation running on the same as emulated CPU platform through real CPU without emulating it: so, theoretically, you should be able someday to run QEMU on PPC Macs with the “same” speed.

KVM isn't really emulation, but a virtual machine. The code is executed natively by the CPU, but run in a virtual environment.

One thing I'd like to know, could a big-endian PowerPC virtual machine run on a little-endian PowerPC host OS?

Hans

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Hans

I have a question for you, but I am not sure if you are "Hans de Ruiter" who pushed the graphics card support under AmigaOs4.1. If you are, I have already read a few things about you.

To my question:

The Sm502/1 which is also used in the Sam460 as graphics unit does this chip support 32bit output on real hardware or is it limited to 16bit there too. ?

Under AmigaOs4.1 Ranger the chip is listed as supporting the R8G8B8 texture format, but for some reason not yet known the driver does not switch to 24/32 bit mode or AmigaOs4.1 does not offer other modes than 16 bit.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Maijestro
Based on the https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20S ... 0PDFs/SM502_PB_8-1-08.pdf the chip seems to support up to 1280x1024 and at the diagram there is 8/16/32bpp mentioned at the Graphics, Video, and CRT Graphics layer.

I am not an expert on these chips or documentation but my understanding is that it supports the necessary colour depth.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Maijestro

The SM502 data manual says that the chip supports 32bpp for the main and video layers.

The sam460ex manual says the following:

5 – the onboard graphic card has a maximum resolution of 1280x1024 pixels (4:3) or
1440x900 pixels (16:9).
Supports DDC2D hardware accelerationhardware sprites (3 colors) and PIP.
There is no support for 3D or compositing.
Some operating systems may limit the color resolution to 8 and 16 bits.


It doesn't elaborate on "Some operating systems" or why there's this limitation.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@geennaam

Thank you for this information.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Maijestro

Yes, I'm the Hans de Ruiter who wrote the RadeonHD & RadeonRX drivers. I wasn't involved in the SM502 drivers, though. I see that your question has been answered already.

@all

Could someone please cross-post the hardware vs emulation survey (link)to non-English forums? So far only amiga-news.de and amigaportal.cz seem to have picked it up.

The more responses, the more accurate a picture we get.

EDIT: Also, please don't be a jerk and try to submit multiple times. You're just corrupting the results that way, and everybody loses (including you).

Hans

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Hans

You can be sure that our English-language version of the news is read by all, whether or not English is the mother tongue.
But I try to do some additional PR...

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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I wanted to apologize for the message from a few days ago.

Even if communicating with people who are part of a forum.
sometimes it is difficult to understand the concept of what you want to ask.

But I am a polite person and always have been.
I probably reacted impulsively and it's not like me.

In this forum I have always been helped and I can not say the opposite.

I've been going through a bad time for a year now.

My wife went to heaven after a long illness.

And it's hard for me to resume living normally.

Well... I hope you can understand this message

Life they say goes on but it's really hard for me.
There hasn't been a single day that I haven't thought about her for a year now.

That's all, for me talking about computer science somehow distracts me.

I apologize again for the probably too impulsive message.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@white

Quote:
I've been going through a bad time for a year now.

My wife went to heaven after a long illness.

Very sorry to hear that. My condolences to you and your family.

Hans

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@white

hugs @white

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@Raziel
@Hans

Thanks, I really appreciate it

I was lucky, I met someone special
And above all a good person

I wanted to grow old with her
only 52 years old like me, a young age
20 years together has been beautiful

I hope one day to meet her again somewhere.

Now, I would like to return to this topic otherwise it becomes sad

I simply wanted to explain the reason for my message.

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Re: What the fastest possible x64 emulation way of OS4 today ?
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@white

My condolences to you and your family.

Best wishes,
redfox

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