BBoot on real Pegasos 2

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flash

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 22:29 #41

Just popping in

@joerg

If Emu68K PPC support project is targeted for AmigaOS3.x/PPC is out of my interest.
..I'm waiting for Mirari board or/and a QEMU full supported AmigaOS solution.

About BBoot I think problem with upper/lowercase module letters is inside "boot_aos.c" BBoot source code.

smarkusg

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 22:36 #42

Quite a regular

@flash

see here -> https://www.amigans.net/modules/newbb/ ... id=141355#forumpost141355

balaton

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 22:46 #43

Quite a regular

@joerg
Quote:

It was always that way on AmigaOS 4.x, since about 25 years already.

Maybe time to change. There could be case sensitive filesystems where it would not work and zip may have multiple files in it with different case and then a random of those would be found. Only case sensitive is unambigous here.
Quote:

Among other parts BBoot is a replacement for the SLB and therefore should work the same way as the originals: case insensitive name comparison in the file loading part.

BBoot loads from zip which is case sensitive, SLB and amigaboot load from case insensitive filesystems. It would work the same if they loaded from case sensitive filesystem. I know it may be annoying to get this error but better fix either in Kicklayout or file name so they match then there should be no problem. All files are listed with correct case except someone somewhere mistyped SmartFileSystem and that's causing problem.

https://qmiga.codeberg.page/

nbache

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 22:50 #44

Just can't stay away

@joerg
Quote:

@smarkusg
Quote:
It is not BBoot's fault that someone decided that case sensitivity is not important.

It was always that way on AmigaOS 4.x, since about 25 years already.

I think it was actually that way in all generations of AmigasOS. My first one was an A500 with v1.3 (in 1989), and it was certainly case insensitive.

It's "a feature, not a bug" - part of what makes AmigaOS helpful for users, not making users having to help the system.

Best regards,

Niels

balaton

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 22:52 #45

Quite a regular

@flash
Quote:

About BBoot I think problem with upper/lowercase module letters is inside "boot_aos.c" BBoot source code.

More in zip/zip.c. But BBoot runs without an OS so it has no libc but needs to supply its own which has no strcasecmp so to do that I'd need to implement that first. It would add additional code and make the bboot executable bigger for something that can be easily fixed by either renaming the file or correcting the Kicklayout to match. It just does not worth the hassle in my opinion because having correct filenames listed in Kicklayout is also more correct. BBoot should already give an error message about file not found with name so if somebody sees that can check the filename and see they differ. It's also in the docs and FAQ.

https://qmiga.codeberg.page/

nbache

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 23:01 #46

Just can't stay away

@balaton
Quote:

Maybe time to change.

Never!

Quote:

There could be case sensitive filesystems where it would not work

There was actually - I believe some file systems (ported from elsewhere?) could be set to be case sensitive under AmigaOS, but noone uses that feature, as the rest of the system isn't made to expect such a non-Amigaish feature.

Quote:

BBoot loads from zip which is case sensitive

Well, it shouldn't, then. I'm not sure if all ports of Unzip are the same, but at least the Amiga one has the modifier "-C match filenames case-insensitively".

Best regards,

Niels

balaton

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 23:02 #47

Quite a regular

@nbache
Quote:

I think it was actually that way in all generations of AmigasOS. My first one was an A500 with v1.3 (in 1989), and it was certainly case insensitive.

Yes I know but zip can store files with different case in same file so it's not case insensitive like Amiga filesystems are. If you copy Kickstart files on Unix and apply updates (as Kyvos may do) you may end up with both SmartFilesystem and SmartFileSystem in Kickstart.zip then it will find one of them randomly. I'd rather make sure the Kicklayout and files in zip match even if it works with other boot loaders and file systems. They already match for all other files.

https://qmiga.codeberg.page/

balaton

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Yesterday 23:12 #48

Quite a regular

@nbache
Quote:

@balaton
Quote:
Maybe time to change.

Never!

MacOS also had case insensitive file system but since MacOS X (being Unix based) had option to use case sensitive. Not sure if they already made that default or still case insensitive. It may cause problems when porting software from Unix but in AmigaOS having CommandsWithWeirdCapitalisation it would be awkward to type those always that way. Maybe that's why it was case insensitive or that was the norm back then. But I only said to fix Kickstart files to match Kicklayout which I think should be that way and reasonable to expect. It's only one typo that causes annoyance and only because Enhancer Software updates SmartFilesystem to SmartFileSystem but fails to also update Kicklayout accordingly. Fix Enhancer or don't use it, then no problem.

https://qmiga.codeberg.page/

joerg

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Today 16:41 #49

Home away from home

@nbache
Quote:

I think it was actually that way in all generations of AmigasOS.

Yes, but that's irrelevant for AmigaOS 4.x, even on classic Amigas.
Not sure anymore, but at best C:BootLoader (m68k, required for loading the AmigaOS 4.x kickstart modules and booting it) and my L:BootCDFileSystem (m68k, required for installing AmigaOS 4.x from CD to HD on m68k AmigaOS versions) are working with AmigaOS 2.x, maybe one or both even requires AmigaOS 3.x, but definitely don't work with AmigaOS 1.x.
Quote:

My first one was an A500 with v1.3 (in 1989), and it was certainly case insensitive.

My first Amiga, which I got around 1987 +/- 1 year, was an Amiga

No numbers. Only later it was renamed to "Amiga 1000", after the A500 and A2000, in the UK additionally the A1500 (= A2000 with 2 floppy drives) were released.
IIRC it had 256 KB motherboard RAM + 256 KB Trapdor RAM (+ 256 KB WORM for one of the the 2 Kickstart floppy disks included, Kickstart versions 1.0 and 1.1), and it was delivered with a French/Belgian keyboard with stickers for the different German keyboard layout, because there were no German versions of the keyboard produced yet...
Quote:

It's "a feature, not a bug"

👍

nbache

Re: BBoot on real Pegasos 2

Posted on: Today 22:56 #50

Just can't stay away

@balaton

Quote:

But BBoot runs without an OS so it has no libc but needs to supply its own which has no strcasecmp so to do that I'd need to implement that first.

and

Quote:

But I only said to fix Kickstart files to match Kicklayout which I think should be that way and reasonable to expect.

Yes, you're right, and I think I may have been carried away down the road of defending "the Amiga way". Maybe what triggered it was that I read an opinion into it that "AmigaOS is silly because it maintains case insensitivity, while mainstream OSs don't" or something. That tends to ignite the defensive side of me

.

In fact, thinking about your specific issue, it might be reasonable to expect users who use a particular host OS with case sensitive file system(s) to know about this and take the consequence of making sure the files going into the .zip have correct casing. Even if they are using Kyvos to help them with the setup.

BTW, I don't use QEMU/BBoot or Kyvos myself (I have enough real Amiga NG hardware), but I find it interesting to read about users doing it and about the possibilities and challenges they meet.

Best regards,

Niels

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