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Re: OpenGL - Refreshing window without gl***func( .... ) ?
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@freddix

Normally, you would use glutPostRedisplay() for this effect.

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Re: page_sweep error
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@Paul

Thanks for the pointers. The bug has been fixed in the meantime and the fix will be included in the next update.

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Re: OS4 Install in 25 mins ?
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@nexus

Quote:
Are there any problems with DMA and AOS4.1/Sam?


No, there aren't any DMA problems on the Sam.

As far as I remember, DMA is turned on by default. There have been reports of some CD-ROM drives that were incredibly slow with AmigaOS, but the reason for that is unknown.

I have one of those drives, too, and the problem I see is that usually, the disk doesn't spin up to full speed. It probably is an incompatibility with the CD-ROM's firmware.
Therefore, installation takes 20 minutes on some machines, and 5 or less on others (or 30 seconds when I did the test installs from RAM disk)

And as Niels said, it's not an image because it's using the files on the disk to boot.

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Re: Devpac 3.x, AmigaOS 4.x and PowerPC
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@freddix

Quote:

But DEVPAC is 680x0 and 6888x only ...
Is there a way to change this ? use another linker than monam/genam to make DEVPAC able to compile PPC source code ?


No. It's not possible to change that.

If you want to program in PPC assembler, you can use 'as' that comes with the SDK.

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Re: New stuff on OS4Depot for AmigaO4.1 crashes on AmigaOS4.0
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@ZeroG

Quote:
And this link library only does a OpenLibrary("whatever.library", 0) call. It will open any version and the app will crash.


That still doesn't release you from the responsibility to check for the system revision when you use features added in that revision

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Re: 4.1 is OUT
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@TSK

Quote:
The size must be powers of 2. It's in the autodocs: "The width of the texture in pixels. Must be 2^n". Or is this gfx card related limit ?


Oh, that.... yeah, it is graphics card related.

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Re: 4.1 is OUT
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@TSK

Quote:
Is texture size limit removed now ?


What texture size limit ?

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Re: Need a tester
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@Raziel

Quote:
You actually got some spare time to work on ports for OS4?


What I always fund peculiar is that people really think that I wouldn't be doing anything else but work on OS4 all the time. I know this was probably meant as a joke by you, but on a certain other site the usual suspect said when it became known Hans-J?rg was working on JA2: "They should finish OS4 first"....

Well, doh. Guess what, like every other working person in the world, we simply take the liberty not to have work hours around the clock. I guess it would be shocking to know that I even have non-computer hobbies...

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Re: Your Attention Please! Your Attention Please!
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@Mikey_C

Quote:
(Please note, I am not 100% sure on this, but I don't think the Friedens would wish you to donate money towards OS4 via this site. I am sure this is for their porting efforts only - Quake3?)


Actually, I don't know why you would assume that. A lot of people have homepages with a "donate" button, but you wouldn't ask them if they take donations towards their respective work, would you

This site is ours, it's not related in any way to Hyperion Entertainment or any other company involved in the Amiga business. As such, it's an enthusiast's homepage like countless others out there.

And yes, before you ask, getting Quake 3 up to specs is on the table, too, as well as several other projects.


@ All

Thanks for the donations Much appreciated

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Re: Latest News on Live 'C' Programming event in UK (for Complete Beginners)
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@Mikey_C

Quote:
- all worship at the alter of Friedens and other mighty OS4 Developers


Sigh...
OS4 is an effort of more than 50 people, and no single person has any big impact on the thing. It's the combined effort of all people involved that makes OS4.

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Re: Warzone 2100 AmigaOS 4 port?
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@Rudei

Quote:

Rudei wrote:
Ok, I'll bite, why?


Because:

Why not ?

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Re: Warzone 2100 AmigaOS 4 port?
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@AmigaPapst

Quote:

But can you create a port with the current minigl 1.5 or need you a better 3D system?


The SDL version of Warzone (which is of course the most sensible place to start) uses an external library that needs OpenGL evaluators for font rendering. The currently released version of MiniGL doesn't support that.

However, I implemented those for the next version of MiniGL (Currently automatic normal generation is still giving me headaches, though).

Homeworld needs glDrawPixels, something I wanted to add to MiniGL since ages. It also uses a texture target of GL_PROXY_TEXTURE_2D and glGetTexLevelParameter. All of those will also be implemented in the next MiniGL version.

Guess why ;)

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Re: Why quake 3 doesn't Work ???
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@pseudaxos

Quote:
OK, il'll see


But you still didn't tell me what happens ?

Quote:
But can I put 1 GO of memory into my ?A1 to boost him ?


No idea, really, sorry

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Re: Why quake 3 doesn't Work ???
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Since I did the port, here's some comments:

First of all: Do NOT give me a "It doesn't work". "It doesn't work" is not enough information to even guess why it is "not working" for you.

What happens ? Crash ? What crash ? Any output on the shell ? Total freeze ? Anything in the debug buffer (DumpDebugBuffer) ?

Secondly, there might be bugs in it, but as I said numerous times before, I can play it for an hour without problems. I know there's some problem in MiniGL regarding the clip planes code (you sometimes see a "hall of mirrors" effect when looking into mirrors or portals), but that doesn't cause crashes (at least for me).

In general, Quake 3 needs a heap of memory and stack. Make you to use a very large stack, make it one or even two megabytes if you experience crashes. It won't work with 256 MB, and should work with 512. However, there's nothing in there that prevents it from cashing game resources, so I would guess that it will need more memory once you changed levels a few times, or play online with lots of people with different player models (There are options to reduce texture size, simple items and enforcement of default player models, you might want to experiment with them).

Also, make sure you're using the newest MiniGL, older version lack the required functionality.

Finally, make sure that you are using the very latest Quake 3 (I think that's 1.32), all other versions will not work.

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Re: Status of OpenGL (or compatible) for OS4
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@nubechecorre

Quote:

nubechecorre wrote:
Will this help you in the development of ati driver for the amiga os ? :

http://ati.amd.com/developer/open_gpu_documentation.html


No

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Re: Deneb under OS 4?
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@mboehmer

Quote:
(which was a feature?) ... Under OS4 this behaviour has been changed, whether this is intended or not.


This behavior was of course intended. OS4 does no longer use physical memory. Such a model will lead to fragmentation, and thus will eventually make the system unusable.

Therefore, memory is allocated in pages that might or might not be contiguous. This will allow allocation to succeed even in situations where it would fail on OS3. This allows for things like paging, on-demand mapping, etc....

Overall, this was IMHO the best decision we ever made when doing the kernel.

The problem is that a lot of programmers (and I'm not trying to blame anyone) have been relying on undocumented features, internal structures etc.

A good example is the peeking of the allocation size that used to be in front of the memory block allocated. In OS4, the memory size is no longer tracked in such a way, in fact, the memory size depends on the position in memory (i.e. each page only holds memory blocks of the same size). So in essence, the long word isn't needed anymore and therefore has been removed. I already received a lot of blame for this, although peeking in front of the memory you allocated is plain and simply wrong. You MUST NOT peek around outside the memory that has been allocated by you.

The physical contiguous memory allocation is a similar thing. It was never guaranteed, and if you rely on it, you are using an implementation detail. This is a bug in your software, as simple as that.


Quote:
And yes, I consider this particular detail in OS4 as broken.


I'm sorry, that is simply wrong. If you rely on internals of the system that aren't documented, you are to blame, not me. CachePreDMA/CachePostDMA have been there for a long time, and even old Commodore guidelines asked you to use these functions. If you are not using them, then sorry, I consider you driver broken.

The fact that these functions are buggy in OS4 doesn't change the facts.

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Re: 68k application in OS4Depot? No!
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@hotrod

Quote:

hotrod wrote:
@Rogue
but still a few selected important software should be there even if they are still 68k.


That's what he meant: It doesn't matter, really if they are 68k, the idea is that they do work, i.e. have been tested and are known to work on OS4

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Re: OpenGL on OS4?
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@Hans

Quote:

Hans wrote:
@tfrieden
Will Cairo become the official replacement 2D API (as in the API that gadgets use)? Or just another toolkit that applications can use? I'm just curious as to what the plans are for 2D.


No idea, there's nothing written in stone yet.

Quote:

Cairo's OpenGL backend is via glitz, which appears to need a minimum of OpenGL v1.2. Obviously some features require higher versions and/or extensions, but it might be possible for glitz to work with MiniGL.


It needs a few functions that are missing right now, namely glReadBuffer, glDrawBuffer, glCopyPixels and glGetTexImage2d. Nothing that is too difficult to add, and in fact, I was considering it already

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Re: OpenGL on OS4?
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@Samurai_Crow

Quote:
OpenGL would be the most powerful and flexible of the 3


That depends on your needs. For 2d graphics, Cairo is better than OpenGL since it also handles things that OpenGl doesn't even touch, like fonts.

Cairo is specialized for 2d vector graphcs, OpenGL is much more basic. Of course, the more basic system has more "possibilities" so to speak, but it really depends on what you are doing.

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Re: OpenGL on OS4?
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@gregthecanuck

Quote:

gregthecanuck wrote:
@Thread
In the past the following systems have been discussed:

- Cairo
- AGG
- OpenGL

What direction is Hyperion leaning towards on the graphics API?

How would each of these systems be supported?


OpenGL is a fundamental system, Cairo can build on top of it. As such, once OpenGL is there, Cairo is there, too.

Quote:
Which API would be the "bare metal layer" just before calling the graphic card drivers?


OpenGL is suitable for the lowest level, as is Cairo, but since Cairo requires compositing, which can be accelerated with OpenGL, Cairo will sit on top of OpenGL.

Quote:
Which API would be exposed to Joe Q. Programmer?


All of them

@LiveForIt
Quote:
way 2D?

way not reander the kickstart in 3D?


Because at the lowest level, you need a 2d kernel that handles the basic things, like setting up a display, framebuffer, drawables etc... Rogue wasn't talking about how the actual rendering is done, but referring to the fact that every graphics system, no matter how it is built, needs this basic functionality.

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