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Rogue

Re: Whdload for OS4 on P5-cards?

Posted on: 2007/8/31 20:00 #421

Quite a regular

@Helge

One of our beta testers tried some WHDLoad game and it failed. It seems that WHDLoad does a few very strange things which might not work on OS 4, but I don't have any clue about it so I cannot really comment on the likelihood of it ever working.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/31 19:58 #422

Quite a regular

@Alkaron

The definite goal is to make it possible to install OS 4 even if no prior operating system is installed, i.e. you will not need to go through a 3.1 install first.

The most likely scenario is that we'll include a floppy disk with the CD-Rom that does the relevant setup. I already made something like that to boot an install CD on the classic without any prior setup.

I would certainly want to avoid anything that asks you to look for your old 3.1 install disks

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/31 14:12 #423

Quite a regular

@Spirantho

Can't promise anything, we'll definitely look into that StartDMA issue though.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/31 14:11 #424

Quite a regular

@xeron

Quote:

xeron wrote:

If you can manage with a 10Mbit network card and no sound card

The sound card issue might have a solution, although I can't say for sure yet.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/31 14:08 #425

Quite a regular

@mailman

(edit: I should actually WRITE something to ;))

The installer will give you the option of running Media Toolbox (the partitioning software) and/or format the drive. It will not force you to it, and you are free to try any other combination, but believe me that most other combinations will mean shooting yourself in the foot

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/29 16:02 #426

Quite a regular

@Alkaron

Quote:

I would not give up on Amiga if OS4 wasnt released for CA.. If it wont be released I will sell my BPPC card and try to get a NG amiga (of some sort)

I can assure you that AmigaOS 4.0 will be released for the classic. It would be pretty pointless for me to work (fulltime currently) on it if we didn't intent to release it, now would it?

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/29 15:58 #427

Quite a regular

@Helge

Quote:

Helge wrote:

Rogue, can you tell us some details how Mediator support was implemented? Did you write a new pci.library or can the old one from Elbox still be used?

The PCI support for Mediator and Prometheus is implemented like on the AmigaOne, i.e. an extra interface to expansion.library.

The original Elbox PCI library works in emulation, and in theory you can still use it but you must make sure that you don't use any of the OS 4 specific drivers that use PCI then. I would certainly not recommend it.

Quote:

How did you solve the DMA problem? If I remember correctly, Elbox hacked the DMA or it wasnt a real DMA, so it might be difficult to support. I hope that Elbox were helpful with the documentation nonetheless.

DMA is not supported. We were not ready to add any such hacks to our drivers so that you would set aside a bounce buffer on a graphics car (for starters, you don't necessarily have a graphics card in the PCI). We'll try to provide as many functional drivers as possible, but there are limits of course.

Quote:

Do you think the speed will be much improved on a Voodoo with Mediator compared to an old BlizzardVision?

Actually, that is a difficult question. There is an inherent problem, namely that PCI access to the Mediator might cause an exception because the hit is outside the current sliding window. If you have e.g. a Warp3D game, then there will be a lot of there (texture uploads go into a different apperature than registers, causing constant switching and hence loads of exceptions).

We're looking into possible solutions for that, maybe there is one (the Voodoo has automatic "hole counting" that might make access to the register apperature unneeded and hence reduce the switching).

Quote:

I think it's a good idea to support Mediator, because it is much more common than the GRex, which is not supported anymore.

Well, for starters we don't have any documentation on the GREX, so there is little we can do.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/29 15:51 #428

Quite a regular

@Alkaron

An upgrade from an existing installation is not planned. Too many factors would make that process overly complicated.

One thing is that OS 4 requires a file system that supports long filenames, since some of the language files have rather long names. You will need FFS2 (DOS/7) for the boot disk (or SFS) since it will need to be bootable under OS 3.x as well.

Booting AmigaOS 4 on the classic currently works via a 68k program called "BootLoader". This must boot under Kickstart 3.x though.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Whdload for OS4 on P5-cards?

Posted on: 2007/8/28 14:19 #429

Quite a regular

@Helge

I have my doubts that this works, unless these games work while running tools like Enforcer in the background. AmigaOS 4.0 is much more picky when it comes to "random" memory access. For example, while a NULL pointer access on OS 3.x may go unnoticed (or, even more likely, crash on an entirely different place) this will cause a program to crash outright on AmigaOS 4.0

So, in general, I don't think you can say yes or no. It's would depend on both WHDLoad and the individual program.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Conexant TV card test program!

Posted on: 2007/8/22 16:44 #430

Quite a regular

@Spirantho

Quote:

Spirantho wrote:
@Rogue

Interesting.

Maybe it's a side-effect of the old SDK I'm using with the new memory system then, because that's what's happening, even in main memory.

If I do AllocMem(size, MEMF_PUBLIC | MEMF_HWALIGNED) and size is greater than about 2K-3K then StartDMA() returns 0 or -1 (not sure which). If it's less then it returns 1, as you'd expect, and I can use it. This is the limitation I'm working with....

Hmm... can you send me a minimal test program with source code and binary that exhibits the problem?

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: There is hope for OS4 on the Classic.

Posted on: 2007/8/21 23:21 #431

Quite a regular

@Helge

The officially unofficial statement is that currently, I am working on the classic version (just recently added Mediator 1200 and 4000 support).

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: ACK proven untrustworthy

Posted on: 2007/8/20 14:34 #432

Quite a regular

@jahc

The fun part is that *I* don't disagree with him either, it's not like we aren't aware of missing features...

But like I said in another thread, it seems to be impossible to talk with someone that behaves like a 13 year old.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Future AmigaOS

Posted on: 2007/8/20 14:32 #433

Quite a regular

@GregS

Quote:

GregS wrote:
@Rogue

Forgive my ignorance, given the quote taken from here, for the life of me I cannot understand what the problem is, or why it should cause such strong emotions.

I am not quite sure why there was such a "shock" either. It is quite obvious that some of the things that are currently used in every AmigaOS program will prevent complete isolated address spaces to work at any point, so, like I already pointed out, right at the beginning this was planned to be the way it should go.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Conexant TV card test program!

Posted on: 2007/8/20 14:19 #434

Quite a regular

@Spirantho

Quote:

Why does IExec->StartDMA() fail with a return code of -1 when the block isn't contiguous? I'd expect it to
return the correct string of DMAStructs for Scatter/Gather, rather than just failing.... I'm sure there's a good reason for it though. :)

This should not happen. Where is that block located? If it is in video ram, then the reason is simple: It's a bug. StartDMA needs a VMArea, and there is no VMArea over the PCI areas, so any attempt at StartDMA in that area fails.

If it's in main memory, it should definitely return a scatter/gather list.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

Topic | Forum

Rogue

Re: Conexant TV card test program!

Posted on: 2007/8/20 12:28 #435

Quite a regular

@samwel

Quote:

IMHO it's kind of stupid to "hinder" important software
development on this small platform. We need all drivers
and software we can get ASAP.

Oh please...

The reasons for the delays in the SDK have been pointed out repeatedly. I also said there is nothing I can do about it. My hands are full.

So far no one has volunteered to work on the binutils, and as long as that doesn't happen, the new SDK has to wait until I have time to do it myself, which, I'm sorry, will take QUITE a while.

This has nothing to do with "hindering" developers, I just can't change it.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Future OS4 direction

Posted on: 2007/8/15 14:26 #436

Quite a regular

@jahc

This is going to take a good while still.

But yes, this is aimed at getting full memory protection and resource tracking and other things that are missing right now.

Like I wrote on amigaworld.net, this was part of a very early draft I had written.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Future AmigaOS

Posted on: 2007/8/15 13:36 #437

Quite a regular

@RacerX

Quote:

RacerX wrote:
@Rogue

Quote:

I wouldn't call it a sandbox, rather a virtual environment.

Sounds kinda like the early plans for OS5.

I don't like to call it OS 4.x or OS 5. It's what we have planned for the future, what version number this will be I don't know.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: ACK proven untrustworthy

Posted on: 2007/8/15 13:34 #438

Quite a regular

@ChrisH

Quote:

Since nearly every attempt I make at a polite post gets misinterpreted by the moderator(s) as some weird way of trolling, not to mention that I feel like I have been treated as a troll until proven innocent, I don't expect to visit Amigans.net much more. I simply don't seem to be compatible with Amigans.net .

Funny you should talk about being polite, seeing how you quote me out of context on amigaworld.net under a subject that was chosen to attract trolls. How you can talk about politeness is beyond me, and from this point forward, my signature explicitly forbids to quote me on a different thread except for the one that it was written on.

I would have thought that general politeness would dictate that anyway, but apparently, your politeness isn't that far evolved yet.

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: Future AmigaOS

Posted on: 2007/8/14 10:43 #439

Quite a regular

@Mikey_C

Well, certainly less armchair lawyers here

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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Rogue

Re: ACK proven untrustworthy

Posted on: 2007/8/14 10:42 #440

Quite a regular

@Atheist

Quote:

Atheist wrote:
I hate to bemoan the issue, but let's just say and admit that, this OS isn't for everybody, and I guess that includes you, keisangi.

No, it definitely isn't. It wasn't intended as such either, not yet at any rate.

Quote:

Congrats, 100 posts on the BEST Amiga website!!!!!!!!

Heh, tempus fugit

Quote:

Also, to you and all of the other AOS4.x developers, a solemn "thank you".

I think I speak for all the OS 4 team when I say "you're welcome" :)

Seriously, if you do want to contact me write me a mail. You're more likely to get a reply then.

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