@ferrels

I'll have a look in a couple of hours when I get home

Well, I just have too many disks LOL

And the other thing is I don't even have my Amiga with a disk drive hooked up and won't be doing that for a wee while yet, so sorry but it'll have to wait...

hopefully someone else can help you... I know there was a site online that collected all the revisions of WB released but I can't recall...

@Snuffy

my stack in shell-startup is 1111111

you could always use tar without compression and then bzip2

it's how I used to archive up my gg installations because tar handled softlinks etc properly and there was an option to unarchive and on the fly convert softlinks to real files...

@Chris

That is some sound advice Chris, thank you.

And I do have copies of all the Development disks and infact own the original 2.1 version... I've been collecting alot of the information for years because I knew I'd get to the point where I'd actually use it...

and yes, SDK and all the bits and pieces in place

@Rigo

wasnt there some interest in porting that V program? Vanguard or Valgrind or electric fence or something of that nature...

maybe a real debugger wouldn't be a bad idea at all? I mean what kind of choices do we have? I've even heard some people still use SAS/C because it has a good debugger...

I'm here to motivate you Rigo

@ssolie

The delivery is as important as how the question is constructed, only an intellectually impaired individual would overlook paying attention to this aspect

yes I guess by making that statement I am calling alot of people intellectually impaired LOL

@tonyw

thanks for your pointers

@djrikki

And I was trying to sneak off to bed clear minded (it's midnight here) LOL

I must say regardless of whether it is exactly 100% I must say it's concise and certainly believable... I'll be taking this onboard... I do not wavier at the thought of repeating the prior to make the latter easier to understand...

thanks for your energy and suggestions and measured insight

@Kicko

Thanks!

@tonyw & all

exactly why is gdb next to useless?

back in the day when I used to haunt the gcc mailing lists (I miss those days actually) with 2.95.3 out etc and Gunther Nikl working his magic with 3.x and me harassing them with lame enquires...

I remember gdb has always been useless! and I remember AmigaOS didn't support the dropping of core files?

apart from me running some mud codebases through it (it solved an annoying problem with some circlemud distributions which would freeze randomly) I'd control-c into the window then type continue and the mud would start running again with x amount of missed pulses or ticks etc... heartbeats if you like... years later it was suggested it was an incompatiable wait() function that was the culprit...

Anyway, I'm sure someone has explained this to me before *whistle* but is it just our kernel that makes porting gdb with all its bells and whistles across an impossibility?

Thanks! for any insight

@orgin

Can't think of a better arguement to keep it personal and sensible... I think we can safely say that we've established C as the clear winner for me to begin with...

I'm very grateful for everyones input and I'll be happy to carry on discussing and listening to anything else that the thread brings with it...

Hoping in due time I'm not too annoying when I argue a point only discover I don't know enough, I'm hoping I have sense enough to have an adequate percentage of i's dotted and t's crossed before I stand behind my trails of thought

Thanks All!

@salass00

Yes I've heard that and understood it too...

I think you're just covering the bases in this regards because Hans brought uup the C++ scenario and also, it's not always that difficult to unlearn something if you remember why its done this way now (given these circumstances) and if you have a mind built on acceptance (not so much linear reasoning) then it could be even fun to have to remember where this is now relevant and then it isn't

I will stick with plain ANSI C...

and I am certainly not going to program for any other platform in my lifetime...

I'm 43 now... I hope to have a suitable understanding of the C language by the time I'm 45... then I hope to be able to program suitably for AmigaOS specifically coming up to 50... then I hope to program for 20 years with a useful place somewhere in the world of AmigaOS programming LOL

That might be generous amounts of time? but I'm in no hurry

@samo79

Thanks for that Samo79 but Spot and I have had dealing before in emails even with him sending me his guides directly... and yes, I found his works helpful in getting some mud codebases configured right...

after a while if you keep at it you get to recognise similair things like particular headers missing and replacing %ld with now I can't remember LOL

but I really want to stop all the hit and miss and actually start learning so I can be one of the ones problem solving someone elses problem... besides, that's what I'm better at

It seems I'm destined to learn C and not C++ but I am willing to listen... always better to listen than be stubborn...

except in the case of red verses blue etc etc... there is only one AmigaOS *cackle*

@salass00

I've heard of this outlook; the book I did try working through until I hit a chapter I couldn't get past at that time was designed to teach you ANSI C but with the route of C++ in mind to make the transition easy or easier...

If what you say is true, exactly in reality does this mean? Is there a stepper learning curve or worse documentation OR? I dunno, I'm trying to also understand why there are just as many arguements against learning C++ as there are yours from your point of view...

I have compiled C++ mud codebases as well...

This brought back some memories so I ran off to my HD Backup of 120605 and brought up the string from the button SID bank

LZX -a -e -Qf -r -Y -9 af

I've thought in the past of perhaps contacting chap to release either the code or compile a newer version...

Heck, If I knew where Timm Martin was I'd ask him to release SID2.0 as well... since there are graphic glitches if you use it on OS4.x upwards...

Thank You Guys

I'm happy now

@orgin

Thanks for your input

In hindsight yes I should have stated I couldn't code a bean

I do not mind be pointed towards documentation... I live and breath by and still stand by the concept 'if it has a manual, I can operate and/or understand it' One of the biggest advantages I have in a sense is if I read something I don't understand at the time I believe that is quite all right because once you start actually putting it to use you suddenly realise what it all means

I have many programming books, alot of the abacus series and the bible of programming reference books...

All I really want to know is where should I start given my desired path... to become a competent AmigaOS programmer where do I have to begin?

From the very very beginning or?

Should I just learn universal ANSI C and THEN look at the Amiga?

Should I perhaps pick a mudcode base I really like programmed in C and work on it as a project to learning and using C?

I'm in now rush to produce software, I just want to learn properly etc...

Put it this way... perhaps one day I want to contribute to AmigaOS4.x

but since AmigaOS4.x is running on modern hardwar, should I bother programming for the older Amiga Systems? to get a better understanding of AmigaOS4.x or would that be just beneficial in group hashing brain storming sessions?

Perhaps not having that history could provide me with a fresher look? or perhaps there already exists far too many with that perspective already...

If I don't get any real direction I'll probably just settle for learning ANSI C and using gcc but if there is a better route to my objective that will work and allow me to grow as a firm contributor in the future then please someone! light the path!

ALSO PLEASE NOTE: I do not want any advice to look at another language or similair... thanks for your restraint...

Oops I just re-read your post, you mention if I don't know C I should just start to learn it... ok nod

Hi All

I posted this on Utilitybase a day ago because I thought it was the place to go for advise but ended up with a post from OldFart that didn't exactly help me... So... serious feedback please...

And yes, I'll make it plain... I'm not interested in porting or coding for any other OS or imitation OS other than AmigaOS4.x

-------------------- original post -----------------------

Ok, the time is getting close when I want to pick up a book and starting learning the process of logic sequence etc etc etc...

Would I serve AmigaOS4 development better if I was to start back at the beginning with say SAS/C or just an ANSI C book and the SDK for AmigaOS4...

And no if I have a choice I wouldn't want to program anything to run belowe AmigaOS4.x but that doesn't mean to say I'm not below going back to the start if it'll help me in the long run...

I've done heaps of compiling with gcc but generally I'm only porting unix code and mostly all old Mud Codebases... but I'm thinking just because gcc and it's config scripts make things easy for me I'm not afraid to leave it all behind and start from scratch with say VBCC etc...

knowing what you know now and thinking about coding only for AmigaOS4.x and not at the slightest interested in backward compatiability... what would you do? where would you start? what would you read first? and what compiler/coding packages would you use?

Please some serious input, what you say now could influence the future

Thanks for any serious thoughts, suggestions or/and insight...

-------------------------- end ----------------------------

also joerg I believe alot of us trust your judgement and you deliver there's no doubt about that...

the world is full of individuals that don't make enough things matter...

don't throw it all away!

Besides, I said I'd donate again remember? where do I send that cash now?

@others, don't answer that!

So keep going hmmm joerg

@orgin

ah, that's it, thanks for the explanation and documentation!

@alfkil

hmmm, well at least you're willing to elaborate in your direction... I'm hoping for the best in any case

@salass00

Yes I was going to mention the implementation in ixemul. Made it easy to port some MUD codebases back in the day.

Obviously my understanding of what fork() actually does is limited. I assume it's a child task executed from a parent and kind of detached but not? That's why I thought it could be seperated to the other cpu... a waste for sure (unless the child task is a big task in its own right) but just an idea.

Given the direction the AmigaHW is going (more specifically the support of dual core etc) does this mean we could end up having a type of fork() support? e.g. the child task could be routed and ran through the 2nd cpu?

Has it been done for windows or perhaps it just doesn't work this way.

Just an end of the working day speculation

@Ant

I'm at work so can't look at my SAM... but have you got all the details from your Provider about the pop server client etc?

Visit there web pages and check out there tutorials... even the ones for Microsoft etc since the examples provided use the same values you require to enter in YAM also.

I'm assuming you have a valid up and running network connection. Start up YAM and click on all the sections of the program and just toy around with it a bit...

see how you get on

Have a wee read here too!

http://faq.yam.ch/