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Recent files - OS4Depot - Your one stop for AmigaOS4 files

 
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samwel
Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 10:43    #1
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I just checked out the filesize of SabreMSN and Wookiechat.
1.4MB and 1.7MB

Aren't these filesizes just huge? I mean the programs uses
alot of other libraries for functions.. So how come they become
so big?

Btw this is nothing against Jahc, almost every software for OS4
has huge filesizes.

Is this because GCC creates unoptimized code or what?
Best Regards,

Harry

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jahc
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 11:00    #2
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@samwel

I almost released SabreMSN with a compressor that would reduce the filesize to 350k or so.. but I didnt for some reason. Dunno why (or why not). :)
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kas1e
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 11:27    #3
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@samwel

I think that mostly it because of statically linked librarys and not stripping info. But in general, 700kb or 1700kb today make no sense absolutly.
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interrogative
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 14:54    #4
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@samwel

Could it be a PPC (reduced instruction set) versus 68k (complex instruction set) issue rather than an OS4 issue?
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afxgroup
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 15:05    #5
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because the ELF

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executable_and_Linkable_Format
i'm really tired...
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Kicko
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 15:29    #6
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oh man. talking about small potatoes like 1.5mb. its like taking a picture with a camera. come on....
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xenic
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 17:00    #7
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@samwel
I just D/L the latest WGet and the OS3 binary is 3 times the size (1.4MB) of the OS4 binary (0.4MB) which is even stranger in my view.
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afxgroup
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 17:31    #8
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@xenic

maybe is not stripped or maybe os4 is using shared libraries but 68k exe are always smaller than ppc one
i'm really tired...
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Antique
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 18:10    #9
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@samwel

I don't see that sizes as a problem. Since we now have 512++mb ram,big hds etc.

Was more important when we had 3,5" discs.

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diegocr
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 19:05    #10
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@xenic

Quote:
I just D/L the latest WGet and the OS3 binary is 3 times the size (1.4MB) of the OS4 binary (0.4MB) which is even stranger in my view.


There are three binaries:

1) "wget" (m68k) 1.401Kb statically linked using OpenSSL 1.0.0a

2) "wget-NoSSL" (m68k) 336Kb

3) "wget-OS4" 455Kb dynamically linked using AmiSSL.

all of them are stripped.
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TSK
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 20:59    #11
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Non-stripped files can help authors of software to find and fix bugs more easily (GR can display the name of the crashed function).
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corto
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 21:34    #12
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As it was said, a bigger file size can be due to :
- static libs
- debug stuff (no strip done)
I think the PPC instruction set and the ELF format is minor.
In any cases, today there is absolutely nothing shocking about a 1.5 MB exe.
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Hans
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 22:09    #13
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@TSK

Quote:

TSK wrote:
Non-stripped files can help authors of software to find and fix bugs more easily (GR can display the name of the crashed function).


It's not necessary to leave the debug info in released binaries. All you need to do is keep one copy with the debug symbols on your own hard-drive, and strip the binary that you release. See this page on my website for details.

The one caveat is that people sending you bug reports need to tell you what version they are using, or you won't be able to match debug logs to their corresponding debug file.

Hans

P.S. C++ users can reduce the size of their binary significantly by using the shared-object version of the C++ runtime library instead of statically linking all that streams stuff.

EDIT: Linked to the wrong page. Fixed.


Edited by Hans on 2010/7/14 22:31:09
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afxgroup
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/14 23:13    #14
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@Hans

Quote:

P.S. C++ users can reduce the size of their binary significantly by using the shared-object version of the C++ runtime library instead of statically linking all that streams stuff.

It is better to avoid this Hans, since our libstdc++.so has a lot of problems.. if you link your program with static library all problems gone away.. i'll remove the .so every time i install a compiler..
i'm really tired...
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xenic
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/15 17:08    #15
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@diegocr
Quote:

There are three binaries:

1) "wget" (m68k) 1.401Kb statically linked using OpenSSL 1.0.0a

2) "wget-NoSSL" (m68k) 336Kb

3) "wget-OS4" 455Kb dynamically linked using AmiSSL.

all of them are stripped.


You're right, I should have looked closer. 455kb (for OS4) compared to 336kb (for OS3) is about right. Amiga shared libraries were (and still are) a good idea. With some OS's (and now Amiga it appears), the exact same code is duplicated in multiple programs. Even though SO libs take up less disk space, a copy is loaded into memory for each program using them.
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ChrisH
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/16 10:10    #16
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@Hans Quote:
P.S. C++ users can reduce the size of their binary significantly by using the shared-object version of the C++ runtime library instead of statically linking all that streams stuff.

This will stop your software working on OS4.0 . But given the file-size improvements, it is very tempting! That C++ run-time is huuuge.
Author of the PortablE programming language.
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kas1e
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/16 11:14    #17
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@ChrisH

Can you give any real point today, to use OS4.0 ? Why not 3.9 then ? We all know how buggy os4.0 all in all. Just cant understand for what need to support it.
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samwel
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/16 13:35    #18
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@kas1e

I suppose some want to support classic OS4 users.

But IMO this hinders use of the more advanced features
of later AmigaOS versions. But then again this has always
been the case with every OS. The difference being that
other OS'es users encourages use of new features and
thus making the users upgrade to new OS versions.
Amigans (especially classic users) on the other hand seems
to hate progress and want to use the same OS version
forever, complaining about this and that program not
working for their OS version.

I think it's sad really. So few users should be able to buy
two OS versions in four years IMO.
I also can't understand users that still use classic Amigas
with OS4, upgrade to a cheaper SAM for god sake.
IMO of course
Simply stop supporting OS4.0 & require OS4.1. Then users
will have to upgrade.
Best Regards,

Harry

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kas1e
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/16 13:38    #19
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@samwel
I just think that there are very few classic amiga users, who _really_ use OS. Because almost everything released in last time (which are interesting) always want normal computer, and not 200mhz cpu.

But yep, that is imho only about support of classic users (dunno make it sense today or not)
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samwel
Re: Why the big filesizes for OS4 software?
Posted on: 2010/7/16 13:51    #20
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@kas1e

As an example I have read that Joerg (OWB OS4 author) seems
to support OS4.0. He has been reluctant at using later features
of OS4.1. Dunno why really? Maybe this is not the case anymore?
Best Regards,

Harry

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