Login
Username:

Password:

Remember me



Lost Password?

Register now!

Sections

Who's Online
157 user(s) are online (90 user(s) are browsing Forums)

Members: 0
Guests: 157

more...

Headlines

Forum Index


Board index » All Posts (whose)




Re: The Memory Protection Debacle
Just popping in
Just popping in


@samwel

Well, partly you understand my "problem"... LifeForIt doesn?t really, I think.

To make it clear: I see the need for MP in future versions of OS4, no doubt. BUT (a BIG but) I don?t see any chances to get OS4 in a more advanced state, if we change the path every now and then. I don?t believe in all drivers being useable under a new MP enabled system, I don?t see all the 3rd party libraries running under this system, I don?t see many vital parts of a future OS4 running under a MP enabled system in a relatively short time.

So, we will stay at this half finished level we just reached and we will stay there for a long time, just because we lack developers and many parts of the actual OS4 are not polished or even finished yet.

My problem still is, that development of OS4 only software will be stalled because there are no good development tools, lack of documentation, new OS-features without the right SDK (which now is stalled for an unknown time) and so on.

I have no problem with some discussion about future must have features, but I think that there are much more urgent problems we should solve right now, before we start to work actively on MP and such (and no, I?m not able to solve all this alone but I?m doing my part on it).

Btw., I just own Cubic and I?m working with it. But if you compare it to the tools other systems have, you will see it lacks some very important features (not important for me but for other developers not used to develop for AmigaOS and that are the developers we want).

I understand Rogue?s post and fully agree to it, but I think we think and dream much too far right now. There should be more work concentrated on finishing and polishing the parts we have and then going on to new and must have features with full energy. Actually I have the feeling that this energy is put on too much construction sites, so it may be used very inefficient.

Greetings

Go to top


Re: The Memory Protection Debacle
Just popping in
Just popping in


@samwel

pls read carefully... it won't have benefit if we didn't manage to earn more devloper's interest for the platform.

This isn't possible yet, just because the development system is not even fully useable (latest SDK isn't there, gdb is more work to guess the failure than a help etc.).

All I say is that we should concentrate right now on the OS/development system before we put useless efforts on theories that will possibly last another 5-6 years before they become reality.

It's all the same when such discussions emerge: Everybody is talking about fine "must have" features that are just a pancake on the top, if they will appear one day in the far future, but the flaws of the system that exist yet will be forgotten every time.

Nobody is seriously using the possibilities AmigaOS bears right now. Where are the really good games everybody wants to see? Some SDL based efforts were made (ports), that's it. The often demanded development tools? Well, some half-finished ports, again. Very few AmigaOS only programs saw the light of the world until now.

OS4 is transformed to a never ending construction site, because lots of the new features and enhancements we just have don't get the attention they badly need because everybody is dreaming of things like MP and so on.

What about AmigaInput? What about the USB subsystem? What about 2D/3D hardware acceleration? More SCSI drivers? A real good debugger? More development documentation? I can ask the whole day on, there will be no satisfying answer.

I really know that there are not as much developers as needed, but to dream every day of new things to implement to the OS won't make the situation better.

All I ask is to start to use the things we have right now, polish them, make them more useful, expand them where it is badly needed (there are lots of fields to explore, polish and expand, believe me).

We have enough time to implement e.g. MP half a year or a year later. AmigaOS cannot compete in the actual market in this half finished state it is in, regardless if it bears MP facilties or not. It could, even without MP, if it would be in a better state than it is yet.

Greetings

P.S.: I own a OS4 system and I'm quite happy with it as a user, but not as a developer. I don't like command line developing using e.g. vi or NotePad, abcshell and a command line gcc with make. We all know that there were gui driven development tools in the past (and they weren't such bad as was said again and again) and that other platforms have these tools for years now. But for AmigaOS such tools are simply not possible, because lots of people don't see the point and keep on dreaming about things they don't need that urgently.

Go to top


Re: The Memory Protection Debacle
Just popping in
Just popping in


@LiveForIt

No, I don?t make a mistake here... you mentioned the exact problem... there will be no benefit of MP and such, IF there will not be more programmers (regardless if fulltime or hobbyists). What?s the big use of a handful (possibly ported and bloated) programs that won?t break the system?

So, first stage should be making really useable build tools, fully working compilers, debuggers and such. MP is a future topic, but I fear that people use too much energy on it instead of doing all they can to get a good foundation for development again.

Greetings,

Go to top


Re: The Memory Protection Debacle
Just popping in
Just popping in


Hm, I think we make too many steps in advance here... I see lots of people writing things like "MP eases software development", "helps writing better code" et al, but (please excuse me) where the hell is these software?

Let?s face it: We discuss future features of the OS without having that much software that will definetly need these features right now (or even in near future).

Where is the need to publish software before a competitor does? Where?s the competition?

Where is the advantage of MP, if there?s even no actual SDK for the final update providing the "great" feature of shared objects (which I consider really unnecessary but for plain porting and "gcc pleasant" development)?

Well, we discuss the benefits of MP and just have a half usable development system for OS4.

I don?t want to fight the thoughts about OS future of anybody here, but I want to say that we face other, much more urgent, problems that need to be solved right now and that more energy should be put on them instead using all this energy for some nice dreams about future bloatware development (sorry, can?t resist).

Greetings,

Go to top


Re: CyberVisionPPC problems
Just popping in
Just popping in


@shoe

I had these quirks recently, too. Solution was a complete re-install of the cgfx software. I used V42rc6 for this. CVPPC works flawlessy now.

Notez bien: I had no success reactivating the CVPPC by installing the CGFX V4 (CD version) software over my old installation. Only a complete reinstall with rc6 (rc5 should do the trick too) worked. Perhaps it has something to do with the OS-version installation quirks older CGFX versions had. Remember? There were problems with OS3.9 and older versions of cgfx V4, no CGFX screen modes and such.

Greetz

Go to top



TopTop
« 1 ... 5 6 7 (8)




Powered by XOOPS 2.0 © 2001-2023 The XOOPS Project